> There's a lot at play when comparing now and then, I don't think its as easy as pegging it fundamentally on immigration laws. Our government was much smaller then. Our legal system was much smaller then. Policing looked much different. We didn't have welfare programs helping those in need. The list goes on and on, pinning crime statistics on immigration impossible.
From an external point of view it feels almost ANY US welfare program (starting with education or healthcare for everybody) is terrible compared to the counterpart of Europe ones for example so that's not a good argument for uncontrolled immigration in the US.
Then, you'll also see that people is Europe are slowly realizing exactly what I said about some cultures that cannot mix, so maybe the quality of welfare programs have nothing to do with it ?
> Maybe, that would depend largely on how much you think the individual matters compared to the collective. Going back to an earlier era with effectively open immigration, our country was driven much more by the rights of the individual than it is today. If that's what most people want there's nothing wrong with that, but the question isn't as simple as people getting to decide who they want to let in.
Yeah well indeed when there's not much of a society and you're a new world there's no point to gatekeep, indeed. Once you've reached peak country in economy & some values it thus may be worth trying to preserve the culture that brought you there instead of saying it's "oppression" and it must be "deconstructed" by immigration for example.
> From an external point of view it feels almost ANY US welfare program (starting with education or healthcare for everybody) is terrible compared to the counterpart of Europe ones for example so that's not a good argument for uncontrolled immigration in the US.
If you're comparing welfare programs based on cost of the program to the financial benefits to the average person, I'd totally agree. It seems like European programs are generally much better at this than the US.
> Then, you'll also see that people is Europe are slowly realizing exactly what I said about some cultures that cannot mix, so maybe the quality of welfare programs have nothing to do with it ?
Well this gets to the underlying point, immigration and welfare programs are fundamentally at odds. It sounds like you'd prioritize welfare and accept tradeoffs that limit immigration. I just have the opposite priority, I don't believe its my right to tell someone else they can't live here and accept that means welfare programs can't work.
From an external point of view it feels almost ANY US welfare program (starting with education or healthcare for everybody) is terrible compared to the counterpart of Europe ones for example so that's not a good argument for uncontrolled immigration in the US.
Then, you'll also see that people is Europe are slowly realizing exactly what I said about some cultures that cannot mix, so maybe the quality of welfare programs have nothing to do with it ?
> Maybe, that would depend largely on how much you think the individual matters compared to the collective. Going back to an earlier era with effectively open immigration, our country was driven much more by the rights of the individual than it is today. If that's what most people want there's nothing wrong with that, but the question isn't as simple as people getting to decide who they want to let in.
Yeah well indeed when there's not much of a society and you're a new world there's no point to gatekeep, indeed. Once you've reached peak country in economy & some values it thus may be worth trying to preserve the culture that brought you there instead of saying it's "oppression" and it must be "deconstructed" by immigration for example.