Israel annihilating Hamas looks like a winning strategy to decisively eliminate foreign interference from the likes of Iran.
> This is just a very, very bad take (...)
I don't agree. As Iran's control over the likes of Hamas proves, terrorist nations are actively killing the same innocent civilians they are using as human shields with the expectation that the humanitarian crisis inflicted upon their pawns hinders or even prevents any retaliation. The only effective strategy to prevent civilians from being thrown in arms way is to eliminate any perverse incentive leveraged by the likes of Iran to harm innocent civilians as a proxy war strategy.
This is a pipe dream. For every killed Hamas member there are two sons or brothers who are ready to pick up arms. This looks like a fools errand if you ask me. Isreael appear to think that if they just get rid of the last training camp, the last tunnel or the last rocket ramp, then all will be quiet. I honestly don't think they really believe that. I think the campaign is a populism fueled killing spree for a domestic audience. The collateral and civilian damage isn't a side effect but a feature. And they know Hamas isn't weakened long term by it but the opposite. But they do it anyway because of domestic politics.
This is almost certainly not true, at least to the extent you portray it. Sure, domestic Israeli politics plays into everything (as politics always does in a democracy).
But you have to realize a few things - this is wrecking the Israeli economy, Israel is losing soldiers in this current war daily, and everyone in Israel personally knows someone on the front lines of the fighting. This isn't some vague "other people are fighting a war and might get killed", this is people you know personally fighting that war.
No one sane would support a "killing spree" with no end in sight, if not for morality's sake, just for the fact that it's hurting Israel a lot. In fact, it would be far "easier" on Israel, in that sense, to just bomb a lot more, kill far more civilians, but end this war much sooner. Of course it would be a moral travesty, but if Israel was going by pure populist anger, that'd probably be the course it would take.
There are some people in Israel advocating for exactly this - increase the amount of bombing in order to lower the risk to Israeli soldiers.
ISIS is mostly gone and a non-threat. Al-Qaeda as well. Nazism is a thing of the past.
Sure you have neo-nazis in different places like Russia, US, Gaza (looks like "Mein Kampf" is the most popular book there after Koran) but that's just deranged individuals, not infrastructure.
So yes, Hamas will be there for decades but mostly as an ideology of a sick people, Israel physically eliminated any future threat from this place for a long, long time.
> With the beginning of the Russo-Ukrainian War, Russian neo-Nazis have achieved international attention for their militant support of Russian-backed separatist forces in eastern Ukraine. Certain groups, such as the Russian Imperial Movement, have been accused of training white supremacists and neo-Nazis from other countries in Europe. The links between these groups and the Russian government, comprising a policy known as managed nationalism, have become particularly noteworthy since the 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine after Russian President Vladimir Putin claimed to be pursuing the "denazification" of Ukraine.
The linked article on "managed nationalism" has more:
> Managed nationalism or controlled nationalism is a term used by some academics to refer to an informal policy of pragmatic collaboration with Russian nationalist and neo-Nazis (or in broader cases, the Russian far-right as a whole) pursued by the government of Russia under Vladimir Putin. ...
> The Russian response to Euromaidan marked a significant revitalisation of managed nationalism. Neo-Nazis, monarchists, Stalinists, and Christian nationalists, as well as Cossack groups, formed the anti-Maidan coalition, and later became militants supporting the Donetsk and Luhansk People's Republics as part of the Russian people's militias in Ukraine, bringing together members of the Russian neo-Nazi community and others from throughout Europe. ...
Israel is also bombing refugee camps in the West Bank right now, destroyed water infrastructure last night. Hamas isn't in the West Bank. A few Politicians are criticizing Israeli politicians openly talking of complete ethnic cleansing of Gaza, but tacitly condone the actions.
Terrorists aren't just a fixed group of people, and studies and common sense is that widespread and arbritrary attacks on innocent people increase resentment. It's like an employment program for war mongers and war profiteers. The civilian populations of Israel and the US also don't benefit from this, in addition to the innocents in Palestine Israel as occupying force is obliged to protect under international law.
> The only effective strategy to prevent civilians from being thrown in arms way
... is to not do it actively. Obviously. Otherwise, preventing the harm to innocents can be ruled out as a motivation and justification.
Iran's strategy has been to use their proxy groups to force innocent civilians to be their human shields. Hamas has been thoroughly documented as using basic infrastructure such as hospitals as their command bases, prevent innocent civilians from fleeing war zones under the penalty of death, steal humanitarian aid to cause humanitarian crisis, and even infiltrating supposedly humanitarian organizations to abuse them to further their military and political goals.
Let's face the facts: the likes of Iran actively places civilians in arms way expecting it to be a win-win scenario, as in either it prevents any retaliation or leads people like you to misguide your indignation hoping to weaponize it.
There is a wealth of information on how Iran, through Hamas, is murdering palestinian civilians by playing them as expendable pawns. If you care about the problem then you'd be directing your indignation towards the root of the problem, and do your best to not create an upside to using civilians as sacrificial pawns.
You just repeat the trope about "human shields" in response to attacks in the West Bank, on refugee camps and more, on basic water infrastructure. It has been refuted.
> leads people like you
Can you refrain from personal attacks, as totally lacking of substance as they may be?
> This is what Israel has begun to do - we cut the supply of energy, water and diesel to the Strip … But it’s not enough. In order to make the siege effective, we have to prevent others from giving assistance to Gaza … The people should be told that they have two choices; to stay and to starve, or to leave. If Egypt and other countries prefer that these people will perish in Gaza, this is their choice.
-- Giora Eiland, former head of the Israeli National Security Council
Just ONE of the many many many dozens of such things is enough to refute these tropes about "human shields" and "$evil group and their likes". "(...)" describes the full depth of your counter-argument.
> If you care about the problem then you'd be directing your indignation towards the root of the problem
I am just as outspoken against those who glorify Hamas as I am here. You are, right now, just repeating what I essentially replied to, while ignoring the inconvenient facts I introduced, and making it about me, and "the others". That's all that happened here, what I wrote stands, your attempt to dismiss it stands.
Israel annihilating Hamas looks like a winning strategy to decisively eliminate foreign interference from the likes of Iran.
> This is just a very, very bad take (...)
I don't agree. As Iran's control over the likes of Hamas proves, terrorist nations are actively killing the same innocent civilians they are using as human shields with the expectation that the humanitarian crisis inflicted upon their pawns hinders or even prevents any retaliation. The only effective strategy to prevent civilians from being thrown in arms way is to eliminate any perverse incentive leveraged by the likes of Iran to harm innocent civilians as a proxy war strategy.